[Bonetools] Bonetools Digest, Vol 120, Issue 21 (Miriam LT)

Wed Mar 16 17:50:28 CET 2016

Dear Sonia, 

please, you do not disappoint me in any way. In fact, I am very grateful
to you for all your explanations, and of course for your generosity,
sharing with us your knowledge. 

I thought in the walrus ivory, because of my obvious ignorance...I knew
in some way that I was wrong, but it is the first time I see a so well
preserved bone and I've never seen before the walrus dentine. Now, after
see your photos, I can see and understand much better the structure of
the walrus dentine. Thank you very much. 

All the bests, 

Miriam

---

Miriam Luciañez Triviño
Contrato Predoctoral del Gobierno Vasco

Departamento de Prehistoria y Arqueología
Universidad de Sevilla
María de Padilla s/n. 41004. Sevilla. Spain
Phone: (34) 954 556906
Fax: (34) 954 559920

E-mail: mlucianez at us.es
http://www.departamento.us.es/dpreyarq/web
http://www.grupo.us.es/atlas

El 16/03/2016 16:50, bonetools-request at listserv.niif.hu escribió:

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> Today's Topics:
> 
> 1. Re: Any idea about this function of this artifact ?
> (fotisif at gmail.com)
> 2. Re: Any idea about this function of this artifact ?
> (Christopher Arabatzis)
> 3. Re: Bonetools Digest, Vol 120, Issue 21 (Sonia O'Connor)
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2016 17:44:31 +0200
> From: fotisif at gmail.com
> To: "Mailing list for archaeologists of the research group for the
> study of object and waste of bone, antler. ivory and horn."
> <bonetools at listserv.niif.hu>
> Subject: Re: [Bonetools] Any idea about this function of this artifact
> ?
> Message-ID: <05509134-2C88-4334-B7A7-89C0D61B6E47 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset=utf-8
> 
> Hi Chris 
> any antler finger rings in your material (similar to the Dispilio ones)? Still this seems to be an intact object and not necessarily debris...
> Best
> Fotis
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> 16 ??? 2016, 15:57, ?/? Christopher Arabatzis <christ.arabatzis at gmail.com> ??????:
> 
>> Dear all, 
>> 
>> I hope you are fine.
>> 
>> I'm attaching a photo of an artifact from a neolithic settlement in Greece that dates back to the second half of the 5th millennium B.C. 
>> 
>> Any ideas about its' use are very welcomed.
>> 
>> Best Regards,
>> Chris
>> <832a.jpg>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Bonetools mailing list
>> Bonetools at listserv.niif.hu
>> https://listserv.niif.hu/mailman/listinfo/bonetools
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2016 17:47:43 +0200
> From: Christopher Arabatzis <christ.arabatzis at gmail.com>
> To: "Mailing list for archaeologists of the research group for the
> study of object and waste of bone, antler. ivory and horn."
> <bonetools at listserv.niif.hu>
> Subject: Re: [Bonetools] Any idea about this function of this artifact
> ?
> Message-ID:
> <CAMaGw42XWPqTvOob1jYfv=3CKfBr4KKP7woRXKGkeJ575A1vRA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Fotis,
> There are only 1-2 antler rings as far as I remember.
> Yes, i think that it's intact object as well.
> 
> Ariel,
> Thank you for your image.
> 
> 2016-03-16 17:44 GMT+02:00 <fotisif at gmail.com>:
> 
> Hi Chris
> any antler finger rings in your material (similar to the Dispilio ones)?
> Still this seems to be an intact object and not necessarily debris...
> Best
> Fotis
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> 16 ??? 2016, 15:57, ?/? Christopher Arabatzis <christ.arabatzis at gmail.com>
> ??????:
> 
> Dear all,
> 
> I hope you are fine.
> 
> I'm attaching a photo of an artifact from a neolithic settlement in Greece that dates back to the second half of the 5th millennium B.C. 
> Any ideas about its' use are very welcomed.
> 
> Best Regards,
> Chris
> <832a.jpg>
> _______________________________________________
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Message: 3
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2016 15:49:58 +0000
From: Sonia O'Connor <S.Oconnor at bradford.ac.uk>
To: "Mailing list for archaeologists of the research group for the
    study of object and waste of bone, antler. ivory and horn."
    <bonetools at listserv.niif.hu>
Subject: Re: [Bonetools] Bonetools Digest, Vol 120, Issue 21
Message-ID:

<HE1PR03MB1323BC89A5E30345FB14ABD4CF8A0 at HE1PR03MB1323.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Dear Miriam,
I am sorry to disappoint you but this is definitely not an ivory of any
species. It is bone.

I can see why you might mistake the secondary osteon structures of the
bone for the whorled secondary dentine of the walrus tusk but you have
mistaken the scale of these features. The images in Espinoza and Mann do
not show the features of walrus ivory  clearly.  I have attached a
detail from a transverse section of walrus tusk. On the right is a mm
scale (showing 3 mm divisions). Next to this you can see the banded
(bone-like) outer cementum layer of the tusk, then the primary dentine
and, finally, the secondary dentine on the left.

Notice that the primary dentine of walrus ivory is very homogeneous. It
is minutely layered and does not contain blood vessels or form repeated
bands of variable colour or translucency. The bands in your fragment are
not continuous layers. They are formed by circumferentially aligned
blocks of bone. This is often called plexiform bone because it looks a
bit like a brick wall. Plexiform bone is described and illustrated at
http://www.umich.edu/~bme332/ch9bone/bme332bone.htm

You can also see in my image of walrus ivory that the whorled secondary
dentine is made up of complex and convoluted structures embedded in a
plain dentine matrix. It is quite different in detail to the secondary
osteons in your bone, each of which are made of a column of bone laid
down around a central blood vessel.

As Alice says, I produced the images and text for a web resource to aid
identification of these materials a couple of years ago but,
frustratingly, the construction of the site, which is too complex for me
to undertake, has yet to be completed (Grrrrrrr!).  However, I am always
happy to help and share my knowledge.

All the best,

Sonia
Dr Sonia O'Connor PhD FSA FIIC ACR Honorary Visiting Fellow, University
of York
Post-doctoral Researcher
Archaeological Sciences
Division of AGES,
University of Bradford
Bradford, West Yorkshire, BD7 1DP, UK

tel 01274 23 6498

From: Bonetools [mailto:bonetools-bounces at listserv.niif.hu] On Behalf Of
Miriam Lucia?ez Trivi?o
Sent: 16 March 2016 14:14
To: bonetools at listserv.niif.hu
Cc: bonetools-request at listserv.niif.hu
Subject: Re: [Bonetools] Bonetools Digest, Vol 120, Issue 21

Hello again,

but do you think this is some kind of dentin? I was thinking in a "rare"
(for the context) option: ivory of walrus (Odobenus rosmarus). I've
never seen this material "in direct", so I only know it for published
photos, like in
https://cites.org/sites/default/files/eng/resources/pub/E-Ivory-guide.pdf

Thank you very much,

Miriam
---

Miriam Lucia?ez Trivi?o
Contrato Predoctoral del Gobierno Vasco

Departamento de Prehistoria y Arqueolog?a
Universidad de Sevilla
Mar?a de Padilla s/n. 41004. Sevilla. Spain
Phone: (34) 954 556906
Fax: (34) 954 559920

E-mail: mlucianez at us.es<mailto:mlucianez at us.es>
http://www.departamento.us.es/dpreyarq/web
http://www.grupo.us.es/atlas

El 16/03/2016 14:57,
bonetools-request at listserv.niif.hu<mailto:bonetools-request at listserv.niif.hu>
escribi?:
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: material identification (Alice Choyke)
   2. Any idea about this function of this artifact ?
      (Christopher Arabatzis)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2016 12:06:26 +0100
From: "Alice Choyke" <Choyke at ceu.edu<mailto:Choyke at ceu.edu>>
To: bonetools at listserv.niif.hu<mailto:bonetools at listserv.niif.hu>
Subject: Re: [Bonetools] material identification
Message-ID:
<56E94C42.66DE.00FB.0 at ceu.edu<mailto:56E94C42.66DE.00FB.0 at ceu.edu>>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Sonia - you should use such questions to get your on-line identification
manual kick started - there is a need. As for the exact material , I
will leave that identification to the ivory specialists.

Alice

ALICE M. CHOYKE
Associate Professor
--------------------------------------------------------
Central European University
Medieval Studies Department
Nador u. 9,
1051 Budapest, Hungary
Office: + 36.1.327-3801 choyke at ceu.hu<mailto:choyke at ceu.hu> | www.ceu.hu
[1]<http://www.ceu.hu> |
www.wbrg.net [2]<http://www.wbrg.net> | www.imareal.sbg.ac.at/mad/
[3]<http://www.imareal.sbg.ac.at/mad/> | www.medievalstudies.ceu.hu
[4]<http://www.medievalstudies.ceu.hu>
See CEU story:  www.youtube.com/ceuhungary
[5]<http://www.youtube.com/ceuhungary>
Miriam Lucia?ez Trivi?o<mlucianez at us.es<mailto:mlucianez at us.es>>
3/16/2016 12:03 PM >>>

Dear all,
Could someone help me to identify the osseous material of this piece?
(Attached in the image).
I will be very grateful if you could help me.
Thank you very much,
Miriam
--

Miriam Lucia?ez Trivi?oContrato Predoctoral del Gobierno
VascoDepartamento de Prehistoria y Arqueolog?aUniversidad de
SevillaMar?a de Padilla s/n. 41004. Sevilla. SpainPhone: (34) 954
556906Fax: (34) 954 559920E-mail:
mlucianez at us.eshttp:<mailto:mlucianez at us.eshttp:>//www.departamento.us.es/dpreyarq/webhttp://www.grupo.us.es/atlas
[6]
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------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2016 15:57:27 +0200
From: Christopher Arabatzis
<christ.arabatzis at gmail.com<mailto:christ.arabatzis at gmail.com>>
To: "Mailing list for archaeologists of the research group for the
    study of object and waste of bone, antler. ivory and horn."
    <Bonetools at listserv.niif.hu<mailto:Bonetools at listserv.niif.hu>>
Subject: [Bonetools] Any idea about this function of this artifact ?
Message-ID:

<CAMaGw43bobD7=CbpRr8+eg7E3Jho6Ca=_wzPSLDcZE+i57=ZhQ at mail.gmail.com<mailto:CAMaGw43bobD7=CbpRr8+eg7E3Jho6Ca=_wzPSLDcZE+i57=ZhQ at mail.gmail.com>>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Dear all,

I hope you are fine.

I'm attaching a photo of an artifact from a neolithic settlement in
Greece
that dates back to the second half of the 5th millennium B.C.

Any ideas about its' use are very welcomed.

Best Regards,
Chris
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[3] http://www.imareal.sbg.ac.at/mad/
[4] http://www.medievalstudies.ceu.hu
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